Dear DV,I've never posted, but I am a long time reader. I love your blog. Keep fighting the good fight. I've been in a relationship with a man I dearly love since I finished law school in 2006. We've been living together since last year and have talked about marriage "down the road". I'll be 30 next year and would like to either be a mother or have one on the way by then. The problem is my boyfriend is in no rush. The last time I mentioned it to him he said 'when the economy gets right'. I'm like, when is that? I can't spend the next few years in suspense. I need to know I am with someone who wants the same thing I do. 'Yes, but later' is no longer an option.
Please advise,
ComingOrGoing
Denmark Vesey said ...
Hello COG, welcome to the blog. Read your piece. I feel your pain. I advise you to get pregnant. That's what men and women were designed to do at this stage in life. I think "too much talking" is a bigger epidemic in this country than the "swine flu". Couples can talk about marriage and family to the point where they get in their own way.
Also, most men are scared. Marriage and family is heterosexuality in action. Between the vaccines and Plantation memes, most men today have been subliminally programmed to fear marriage and commitment to a woman. Thus the large number of De Facto Homos (30+ year old men without Chicks).
Just get pregnant, show him the sonogram and get married. Down the road, he will appreciate you kick starting his heterosexuality.
Remember where you heard it best.
Fearlessly Faithful said ...
So I'm one of the BIGGEST fans of DV and I took his "just get pregnant" advice in February 2004. Where that advice led me is here...Today I celebrate the 4th birthday of my beautiful, brilliant and healthy son who arrived with perfect timing..on my 38th birthday.I was engaged to my husband when I got pregnant but he was wavering. Getting pregnant certainly motivated him to follow through on the promise and marry. We enjoyed a beautiful wedding celebration and some blessed moments as husband and wife and as parents. However, he often wavered on whether he wanted to be married.
Today, we're embarking down the road of divorce. He would say he's committed to his son, just not committed to marriage. I would say he's committed to fear and failure. As DV would teach, there's nothing more noble than being a PRESENT husband and father. Only the constant presence of a father can lead a boy to manhood. It's this absence of "father" in so many lives that I attribute to the multitude of FEARFUL men who are lost at being "MEN."
My love for my son will motivate and inspire me to tell him EVERYDAY that his daddy LOVES him, can't wait to see him and is the funniest, tallest (despite his 5 feet, 8 inches) and smartest of them all.
So the choice of whether or not "to just get pregnant," it may or may not motivate a man. The question is, WHAT KIND OF MAN DO YOU WANT AND NEED? The man who has a vision for his life that includes a wife and child and fearlessly accepts that noble undertaking (because we know it's not easy but comes with great rewards) or the man who will only respond to circumstance????? I want the former. Is that visionary man easy to find...absolutely when you approach life fearlessly and faithfully with your own vision.
So my advice (and I'm still living and learning) is to choose the MAN who shares your vision! Always choose love and certainly choose a MAN.
37 comments:
Lmbao!!
"Just get pregnant, show him the sonogram and get married."
Lmao!!!! Yea, that tactic has worked great for 2/3 of unwed baby mama sistahs so far!
I say yo betta smell dat niggas dick! Cuz you aint the only one homegirl!
Is your man the same age as you? Because most 30 year olds are not ready to get married. Either wait or move on. If you move on, he's likely to either get ready, or be grateful the pressure is off him. Either way, better for you.
The knocked up thing will create a lot of resentment. Not the play. He might keep the baby and dump you. I would.
Oops, I meant most 30 year old black men are not ready to get married. Especially professional ones. They are just coming into their own, and not ready to settle down.
Meanwhile 30 year old women are more than ready to settle down. Leads to a whole lotta conflict. Find a man who's a little older. He's ready for the next stage in life.
"Just get pregnant, show him the sonogram and get married."
Is that how your wife got you?
Hey COG,
Thanks for sharing.
It's a bit hard to tell what kind of relationship you have with your man from the scant details you've given. Nevertheless, That Dude is right about +-30 year olds being busy with their careers and everything else comes second. Depending on how he really feels about having kids with you; having a baby might be the best thing even though he wasn't 'ready' for it.
OTOH it could change everything between you: he might try and make it work for the kid's sake but deep down inside he'll choke. He'll choke because he can't deal with having a family suddenly thrust upon him and you'll get pushed away or even resented. I've seen this happen with a few of my male cuzins who go from seeing their baby mothers as Mary to Delila.
Either talk to Bra Man some more or face up to the truth you know deep down inside - sometimes when we seek advice its because we need someone else to help to clarify things in our heads and advise on what we are unsure of, or confirm what we already know but we don't have the courage to admit to ourselves.
I can def relate to your situation to an extent, and I've found talking a lot more helps: its how you talk not so much what you're talking abt that determines the outcome.
I hope things work out for you.
...peace
DV...
"Just get pregnant, show him the sonogram and get married."
Of course, when her time comes, you'll give your daughter the same advice. Right, "DV"?
@ Mike Fisher - LOL!
@ DV - Gee, I don't know about that advice, DV. I'm all for restocking the pond, but I've known black chicks who tried this and it blew up in their faces.
@ COG - His answer is disturbing. I don't imagine he's a moron since he's with you and has a career, so he knows the economy ain't getting better no time soon - if ever.
You might also tell him you really want to get started now, and if doesn't, break up. Give him a few months of no dating or late night calls, and see if he misses you enough to shake his reluctance of marriage.
If not, maybe his love isn't strong enough to sustain a marriage, and given that you've been together for 3-1/2 years, what would change if you remain together to make it stronger? The shared experience of a baby could - but might have the opposite effect.
Well, you're a 29 year old attorney and can afford quality day care, so if you really wants his baby, maybe you should do it, but be prepared to be on your own like the majority of unmarried black mothers.
The ethical thing, however, would be to get his consent first. Odds are he'll say no to that too. It won't feel fair, but nothing is fair in love, or war.
Wrong answer, DV.
Girl, don't get pregnant behind your man's back. That's like telling someone to get what they want by putting the kids in the middle and if your man doesn't do what you want, force him. Wtf, who wants a cornered man or that manipulative woman? Surely, that's not what you want for your child, just because you want to have one NOW. Don't be a fool.
DV, this is lame.
A letter seeking advice? From a woman who graduated law school? To Denmark Vesey?
Suspicious...
Terrible advice DV.
Homegirl needs to find a new man. One who is actually man. Who likes women enough to marry one.
One of my girls had one of those "later when everything is right" excuse-making men. Lived with him for years as it went nowhere. Finally worked up the courage to put out the garbage and, within months, met her now husband.
COG needs to...MOVE...ON.
UBM, I agree the new "advice column" feels fake, but it's a cute idea anyway.
^ Yeah, it is cute. Can't deny that.
Bad advice?
Moi? Nah.
I think that is excellent advice.
Let's walk through it.
1.
A) She can get married to this man.
B) She can not get married to this man.
2.
A) She can have a child with this man
B) She can not have a child with this man
Agreed?
Now 1. A) is an increasingly rare blessing. The marriage rate among young "educated" black people (I'm assuming sista is black) is dropping faster than the value of the US dollar.
B) She's invested a few of her prime years with this man. Failure to marry at this point will have proven a colossal waste of time. Waiting for the fictional “ready” is a head fake.
2. A) Having a child is a blessing. It is a gift that is no longer guaranteed to everyone. Between the toxins in the environment, the Genetically Modified Foods and the vaccines - people simply are not as fertile as they once were. Conceiving a child at this stage in life is an opportunity window that does not stay open for long.
2. B) A woman's reproductive years are what? 16 to 40?
The prime reproductive years are what? 18-30?
Give or take a year here or there? OK. Close enough.
A 30 year old woman who fails to get pregnant is gambling with her God given reproductive capacity. She may not ever have a child at all.
Having a child is a woman's purpose.
Having a child is a woman's purpose.
Yes it is.
Anyone whom an egg comes out of every month was purposed to be a mother.
Fuck Gloria Steinem. But that's another thread.
Anyway.
Imagine that. A 30 year old woman involved with some 30+ De Facto Homo ... waiting for "the economy to get right" until he wants to marry and have a child ... will wake up a 35 year old woman, without a child and a De Facto Homo dating a 24 year old stripper on the side, (who is going to have sense enough to go head and have a baby while she can).
Should she lie to him? No.
Is this cheating? No.
GOC should turn to her man and tell him straight up: “I love you. I want to marry to you. I want to have your baby. I want do it right now. I don’t want to talk about it. I’m not taking the pill. I’m not having sex with no damn rubbers. I love you baby. And now you know.”
Now unless this muhfuggah is Cpt. De Facto Homo ... he’s going to come around. And more importantly he will love his woman for giving him the courage to grow up.
So I'm one of the BIGGEST fans of DV and I took his "just get pregnant" advice in February 2004. Where that advice led me is here...Today I celebrate the 4th birthday of my beautiful, brilliant and healthy son who arrived with perfect timing..on my 38th birthday.
I was engaged to my husband when I got pregnant but he was wavering. Getting pregnant certainly motivated him to follow through on the promise and marry. We enjoyed a beautiful wedding celebration and some blessed moments as husband and wife and as parents. However, he often wavered on whether he wanted to be married.
Today, we're embarking down the road of divorce. He would say he's committed to his son, just not committed to marriage. I would say he's committed to fear and failure. As DV would teach, there's nothing more noble than being a PRESENT husband and father. Only the constant presence of a father can lead a boy to manhood. It's this absence of "father" in so many lives that I attribute to the multitude of FEARFUL men who are lost at being "MEN."
My love for my son will motivate and inspire me to tell him EVERYDAY that his daddy LOVES him, can't wait to see him and is the funniest, tallest (despite his 5 feet, 8 inches) and smartest of them all.
So the choice of whether or not "to just get pregnant," it may or may not motivate a man. The question is, WHAT KIND OF MAN DO YOU WANT AND NEED? The man who has a vision for his life that includes a wife and child and fearlessly accepts that noble undertaking (because we know it's not easy but comes with great rewards) or the man who will only respond to circumstance????? I want the former. Is that visionary man easy to find...absolutely when you approach life fearlessly and faithfully with your own vision.
So my advice (and I'm still living and learning) is to choose the MAN who shares your vision! Always choose love and certainly choose a MAN.
Dv, Dv Dvvvvvvv... I had to read your response to her twice to make sure I was reading Denmark Vesey's blog spot. Are you kidding me? She needs to tell the man what she wants and if he is not on the same page with her, get riddens! Find a man who knows what he wants and have the same goals you have, like getting married and having a baby. Please do not have a baby without having father who will be there with you through the tough times is not being smart. Since you are a successful woman and just want to have a child then I would think twice about that too, children need both mother's and fathers. DV?? hmmm. NO love, no marriage, no sex, yep i said it, No sex, plan parenthood would be out of business if more people thought like this, don't you think? Life is too short for games and game players.Dv is right men take time to mature and being with a selfish man should be a waste of your time, but a good woman know what she wants and will only gravitate to those men who want what she wants. Being lonely is being smart, my advice, get a pet until you able to find the right one.
Come clean be upfront about what you want if he is not on the same page- "do not pass go, do not collect your $200.00 go right on past.
stayinginformed
...Interesting that this particular Anon has chosen to name themselves on this particular thread. Ain't a bad thing, but hey jus' sayin'.
...DV,
What's the success rate of your 'have a baby' love counselling service? And if Fearlessly Faithful is a model example then shouldn't Counsellor DV be more wary of what advice is given to COG. Good for FF that she has a beautiful son, but she's getting divorced bec Bra Man wasn't up for it. Can you really advise the same to COG knowing divorce is one possible outcome?
And BTW the whole GMO, toxins, de facto homo stuff doesn't really work in this context. If I was your 'client' I'd just want you to level with me about matters of the heart. Real Talk.
...peace
FaerlessyFaithful...
"Only the constant presence of a father can lead a boy to manhood. It's this absence of "father" in so many lives that I attribute to the multitude of FEARFUL men who are lost at being 'MEN.'"
Well, that one is easy. Give you soon-to-be-ex-husband full and sole custody of the boy and make sure that you pay generous child support.
Greatest De Facto Homos of all time:
Jesus of Nazareth and Paul of Tarsus
Micheal Fisher says "Well, that one is easy. Give you soon-to-be-ex-husband full and sole custody of the boy and make sure that you pay generous child support."
Excellent advice if founded on the proper assumption...that my soon-to-be ex wants sole custody. He prefers 2 weekends a month. My son's well-being is PRICELESS! I'd gladly pay his father, DV or a MAN OF CHARACTER to be part of my son's life. It's worth that to me! If you forward your CHARACTER resume, I'll consider you too.
Micheal Fisher says "Well, that one is easy. Give you soon-to-be-ex-husband full and sole custody of the boy and make sure that you pay generous child support."
Excellent advice if founded on the proper assumption...that my soon-to-be ex wants sole custody. He prefers 2 weekends a month. My son's well-being is PRICELESS! I'd gladly pay his father, DV or a MAN OF CHARACTER to be part of my son's life. It's worth that to me! If you forward your CHARACTER resume, I'll consider you too.
FearlesslyFaithful...
"Excellent advice if founded on the proper assumption...that my soon-to-be ex wants sole custody."
Well, you did say...
"He would say he's committed to his son..."
Apparently using the "DV-method-of persuasion" didn't work out for you. But, of course, it'll work for "DV"s daughter, thus something must've been wrong with you, and not the man you chose to use the "DV-method-of persuasion" with. By the way, there are plenty of black men who would love to take care of their kids full time. Sorry you hadn't chosen one.
Polygamy existed all over Africa as an aspect of culture or/and religion. Plural marriages have been more common than not in the history of Africa. Many African societies saw children as a form of wealth thus the more children a family had the more powerful it was. Thus polygamy was part of empire building. It was only during the colonial era that plural marriage was perceived as taboo. Esther Stanford, an African-focused lawyer, states that this decline was encouraged because the issues of property ownership conflicted with European colonial interest.[63] It is very common in West Africa (Muslim and traditionalist).
Fearlessly Faithful, you have every right to want a man to be a man! Your man did not live up to his manhood which is taking care of his responsibilities which includes you and your beautiful child. Hold your head up and have a serious conversation with him about his responsibility to his child. Two weekends a month is not bad. By the time he reaches 12-years old make him take the young man full time. Make him, like legally. Boys need their fathers around this age very much. Do your part and the rest will follow. This has to be hard for you, it can be worked out if you will allow it to. I hope you marriage can be saved, you both loved each other right?
What love got to do with it? EVERYTHING!!!
"Love believes all things, hopes all things, love NEVER fails!"
stayinginformed
Dang...
These ladies b sumwhat clueless
Define a MAN by they WANTS
Think they decide when MAN b useless???
This is careless!!!
Means u don't believe in God
Becuz ur tactics b ruthless!!!
Radical autonomists...
This the belief
U can do whatever u WANT with this!!!
Ur body that is...
Self-declaration
U AUTONOMISS!!!
Lacking any principled loyalty
U WANT a baby...
But baby what if this just a NOVELTY???
Can u c what the problem b???
U still invested in Radical autonomy...
Define yur MAN negatively!!!
With ur own sense of desire
Watch uh relationship
Go up in fire
This real dire...
U WANT sumptin'
Think it should change another
But when u get sumptin'
U ready to change and be a mother???
Don't run to your man fo' cover!!!
U gotta ask whether u committed to the whole endeavor
U WANT sumptin' today
Maybe tomorrow u pull the lever???
My advice is that you and your boyfriend start to hang around other couples that are married or on the road to marriage. Most "scared" guys fear being the "only" one of the homies that is married. I was the first of my crew to get married and I was teased relentlessly. I kept my head high. Then, homies started saying, "I Wonder, I see what you're doing and I want to be like you one day." Now, all the homies are married and none of us have been divorced.
Marriage is a mutual survival strategy and most people give up way too early.
IWonderAsIWonder is THE TRUTH.
Iwonder,
You have it. "Attraction not promotion." And certainly not entrapment!
What kind of "love" is it that uses somebody else (kid) to TRAP someone into marriage or parenthood? Women seem to see men as a means to an end. No wonder so many men run away. Aren't they supposed to come first? First you're a wife, THEN a mother. Yes?
Here's a suggestion: Just get his sperm and kick him to the curb. You'll save yourself a lot of money on the reception.
(shaking head)
The moment I read this:
I was engaged to my husband when I got pregnant but he was wavering. Getting pregnant certainly motivated him to follow through on the promise and marry.
I knew 100% for sure that I would soon read this:
Today, we're embarking down the road of divorce.
What DV is suggesting is entrapment. How exactly does one Mr. DV suggest a woman just "Get pregnant"?
Stop taking your pills? Poke holes in condoms? It's true that a beautiful young life and bond are developed, but, at what cost. It's desparate. And a man deserves the right too. If you're desparate for children, adopt. Go to a sperm bank. DO NOT ATTEMPT TO TRAP A MAN. You will be resented forever, and ultimately...despised.
" I was the first of my crew to get married and I was teased relentlessly. I kept my head high. Then, homies started saying, "I Wonder, I see what you're doing and I want to be like you one day."
Ehh...not exactly true.
Iwonder was pressured INTO marriage at a an early age by ideals of plantation promotion, peer pressure and corporate acceptance.
Wife + Family = stability
Stability + tomming = plantation promotion. (aka casa nizzle)
The other cats did wait like 5 years to get married, but 5 years later...still under 30.
"DO NOT ATTEMPT TO TRAP A MAN." Anonymous
1) It's not a trap, if they want to get caught.
I submit any grown ass black man having sex with a grown ass black woman cannot consider himself "trapped" if a baby is produced.
That's like a farmer planting watermelon seeds in the ground claiming to have been "trapped" when a watermelon pops out the earth.
2) Fact is you wouldn't be here Anonymous, if your parents scheduled you like a dental appointment.
"Planned pregnancies" are a Plantation Myth.
90% of the people on the planet were not "planned".
You consider I Wonder "pressured" into marriage?
That's odd.
When a young black man marries a beautiful young black woman he is not "pressured".
He is supported.
The Plantation has conditioned people not to support marriage, but to subconsciously reject it.
The Plantation wants marriage to be viewed as a burden for the same reason they want to squirt monkey virus juice up your nose.
Unmarried people are easier to control.
"Fact is you wouldn't be here Anonymous, if your parents scheduled you like a dental appointment."
And? That would be a big tragedy because ... ?
What a silly argument, that a human's existance justifies all the actions that resulted in that existane. Silly.
" Unmarried people are easier to control."
I submit that the exact antithesis is fact when the controller is the plantation.
" I submit any grown ass black man having sex with a grown ass black woman cannot consider himself "trapped" if a baby is produced."
I submit that this is bullshit. I further submit that you, yourself, do not believe this.
Are you saying that grown ass men cannot be trapped?
Are you saying that grown ass men having sex cannot be trapped?
Are you saying that grown ass men having sex with exclusively black women cannot be trapped?
WTF are you saying? Whatever it is it's nonsense. There are plenty of ways for responsible sexually active men to be trapped, tricked and outright deceived into paternity. All of them are desparate.
DV, let's talk logistics. How does a woman "just get pregnant" anyway?
Take me through it. I mean from A to Z. From grabbing the needle to sifting through the bathroom garbage can. Enlighten me.
DV I'm all for fatherhood and family. But whether or not you belive this, IT AIN'T FOR EVERYONE.
Think about that Anonymous.
What's less silly than existence?
A bear ... walking through the woods ... steps in a sharpened steel snare ... is "trapped".
A man having unprotected sex with a woman for 3 years ... is not "trapped".
He may be bullshitting himself.
But he is not trapped.
How does a woman "get pregnant"?
The same way women have "gotten pregnant" for thousands of years.
They have sex with men. They have sex with men without poisonous "birth control pills" or latex condoms interfering with the process.
Mother nature takes it from there.
Dear Anonomous,
Join DV... Put aside the radical autonomy. Maybe you been had by a black widow wannabe? Seriously... You must put this aside knowing real well how it ought not to be. Can we agree? Planning is disaster when we're talking spirtually. That's what real procreation is, lil' g. Your life ain't a tradegy just because you succeed in seeing the failure in other's being. Being analogous to autonomist by naming yourself anonomous, you let us guess the state of your paralysis. You succumb to a woman more radical... Unable to strategize and get tactical... Be practicool... Make sure you keep your cool. This is the weapon that ruin any fool. Never drool... Create your own school. Say DV inspired you to make use of your tools... You'll be a man who isn't living by another woman's rules. And if you repeat the same mistake and get another one that's real radical. Then the question becomes, "Am I ready to do battle...?"
And see it to the end???
DV, you are like the pied-piper for weak minded white boys longing for acceptance.
I will give you that.
As a man who just passed 7 years of marriage, I can tell that marriage is pure hell if you are not 100 PERCENT COMMITTED TO IT. If you are constantly wavering and wondering about other shit, you'll be trapped in hell. It's "Ride or Die," niggas.
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